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| About the Author Sundari333 Geelong, Victoria 20th April 2010 11:41am #UserID: 3626 Posts: 3 View All Sundari333's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Charles cant spell says... Well bentonite alone wont help sandy soils much, but assuming you are adding organic material as well (sheep manure, coco fiber, dug in tree mulch, compost) then I think 2 handfuls a meter dug in fork/spade depth then watered should be fine to start with. You can add more later in liq form if required. You need to dig it in else it will sit on the surface and stick to everything when its wet. If you cant dig it in due to already existing beds or garden you can "(stolen from a web site) It you take a cup of bentonite, mix it with several cups of water and leave it to soak overnight you will end up with a paste with the consistency of smooth peanut butter. If you then add several cups more water, mix it with the bentonite paste and leave it to soak overnight again you will end up with a paste with the consistency of yoghurt." http://www.gregsindigenouslandscapes.com.au/Gardening%20Tips%20&%20Tricks.htm Mix more liquid and then you can watering can it onto your garden or beds, the fine clay particles will percolate through your sand and add water retention and nutrient retention. | About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 20th April 2010 12:58pm #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author amanda19 Geraldton. WA 20th April 2010 11:10pm #UserID: 2309 Posts: 4607 View All amanda19's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author 21st April 2010 2:14pm #UserID: 0 Posts: View All 's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author Julie Roleystone WA 21st April 2010 7:47pm #UserID: 154 Posts: 1842 View All Julie's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 22nd April 2010 12:46pm #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author Julie Roleystone WA 22nd April 2010 8:00pm #UserID: 154 Posts: 1842 View All Julie's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 22nd April 2010 8:44pm #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Eric says... Hi - thought it may be worth sharing that I've been sourcing bentonite from fertiliser companies and from Elders - they generally have 25kg bags for about $10. If you have them near you it may be worth a look.. For those that like a more scientific approach to things - http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/ag125e/AG125E28.htm I'm not convinced on the amounts they're adding (many kg per square m), but they are talking about very sandy leaching soil so it may be true... | About the Author Eric3 Wimmera 13th May 2010 9:18am #UserID: 3713 Posts: 1 View All Eric3's Edible Fruit Trees |
Charles cant spell says... Well Perth coast sand is often yellow or white sand. So lets say you want 20% sand to keep you solid loose etc. We need to add 80% other stuff to ouch sand base. I wouldn't be surprised if they are adding kg's, but also kg of compost, and kgs of leaf litter/coco fibre etc. So simulating loam, Loam soils are typically comprised of approximately 25 - 50% sand, 30 - 50% silt and 10 - 30% clay by volume. Lets go mid range, 35% sand, 20% clay, 45%silt (organic goodies). If your 1 m of garden bed 33cm deep (1m3 = 1200kg) weighs 400kg, you would need 80ish kg of clay. While that is a rough effort you get the idea. Making loam out of Perth soil/sand is immense. Hence why I have moved to wicking beds, where moisture and nutrient holding is far less of a requirement. | About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 13th May 2010 3:03pm #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Original Post was last edited: 13th May 2010 3:05pm | |
| About the Author amanda19 Geraldton. WA 13th May 2010 4:15pm #UserID: 2309 Posts: 4607 View All amanda19's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Brad says... Source in Perth - 10kg bags for $15 http://www.sustainableoutdoors.com.au/bentonite-clay/ | About the Author Brad2 G hill,Perth 10th January 2011 11:52pm #UserID: 2323 Posts: 762 View All Brad2's Edible Fruit Trees |
| About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 11th January 2011 3:08am #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author Jimmy Perth 11th January 2011 3:40pm #UserID: 2548 Posts: 511 View All Jimmy's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Original Post was last edited: 11th January 2011 3:46pm | |
| About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 12th January 2011 1:54am #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author amanda19 Geraldton Mid West WA 13th January 2011 1:08am #UserID: 2309 Posts: 4607 View All amanda19's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Brad says... the sodium would definitely be bound up. i don't know exactly what they sell in small bags, but there are also other bentonites (e.g. calcium)- they're not all sodium based. it may depend where it was mined / processed. bentonite is used extensively in many industries. Charles - that idea makes a lot of sense. Its used to line farm ponds. and to nitpick - I do not believe that most natural clays are potassium based (in fact I don't even think potassium is significant). what makes you think that? | About the Author Brad2 G hill,Perth 13th January 2011 2:06pm #UserID: 2323 Posts: 762 View All Brad2's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Original Post was last edited: 13th January 2011 2:16pm | |
Charles cant spell says... I cant categorically say its safe and wont cause an issue but I would be very supprised, I dont think the Sodium is an issue its just part of the name. See this page Brad found (supplier) you can look at the chemical composition of both grades. http://www.bentoniteproductswa.com.au/html/product.html. I am guessing the Saponite percentage is the bound up "clay" (Chemically it is hydrated sodium calcium aluminium magnesium silicate hydroxide (Na,Ca)0.33(Al,Mg)2(Si4O10)(OH)2·nH2O.) But it looks like low actual Sodium in there. I would say Sodium Bentonite is just a way of differentiating it from others. I can say taht its used for farm dams everywhere in substantial amounts and used for water reservoirs and used for clarifying potable water, if it was an issue, I doubt it would have these uses. | About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 13th January 2011 2:50pm #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Original Post was last edited: 13th January 2011 2:56pm | |
Charles cant spell says... Either-way its certainly better for the enviro and less toxic than builder plastic, yum.... the only disadvantage over builders plastic I see is Root invasion from surrounding trees. I.e. Plastic is a physical barrier but clay is just to stop the water and nutrients leaching out the bottom. | About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 13th January 2011 2:52pm #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
amanda says... What u are up to sounds great CCS. I am very interested in wicking beds for our next property (if we ever get out of here!!) Um - dunno Brad - just information that I have gleaned along the way - Kevin Handreck talks about clay and potassium etc - in his book Gardening Down Under (CSIRO) He states that it is a great long term source of potassium for sandy soils - but I am no expert, for sure. PS - just went off to find some ref's - but they are all very hardcore! try googling potassium bentonite or potassium in clay etc... One thing I did note was that Na-Bentonite swells quite a bit - so u may want to take this into account in your designs CCS? | About the Author amanda19 Geraldton Mid West WA 13th January 2011 9:11pm #UserID: 2309 Posts: 4607 View All amanda19's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Original Post was last edited: 13th January 2011 9:50pm | |
Rhys says... I think the sodium in the clay shouldn't cause "salinity" problems if that is what you're concerned about Amanda...i remember reading something somewhere once about this issue that seemed to make sense at the time so i was happy to accept it, but i didn't bother committing it to memory sorry...i'll see if i can find the reference again. For people with clay soil like me, the sodium does however cause other problems, but not really a "salinity" issue. Its more to do with the physical properties/solubility/stability of the clay when sodium is the cation, and the main reason gypsum is added to clay soil is to try and replace the sodium ions with calcium ions...i think the 2+ charge on calcium is better than the 1+ charge on sodium. And again, i seem to remember reading that even in this situation, the release of sodium by the calcium shouldn't cause salinity issues. Happy to be proved wrong by someone that knows more on this than i do | About the Author Getafix 13th January 2011 10:50pm #UserID: 3112 Posts: 86 View All Getafix's Edible Fruit Trees |
Charles cant spell says... Cheers amanda thats the main design principle. That is we line the sand hole or brick/paved base with a thick coat of bentonite, you hydrate it so that its workable but not slop, so work you clay into edges etc and create your "liner". Now you can build your wicking bed on top. If it seems to be leaking still you can then fill it with bentonite/water solution and let the leak point gradually close with bentonite particles as the water passes through. Given the bed base will be wet when it needs to seal (duh :)) it might even work :) | About the Author Charlesstillcantspell1 Perth Innaloo 13th January 2011 11:50pm #UserID: 2742 Posts: 411 View All Charlesstillcantspell1's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Original Post was last edited: 13th January 2011 11:55pm | |
| About the Author Brad2 G hill,Perth 14th January 2011 12:46am #UserID: 2323 Posts: 762 View All Brad2's Edible Fruit Trees |
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| About the Author amanda19 Geraldton Mid West WA 14th January 2011 1:34am #UserID: 2309 Posts: 4607 View All amanda19's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Keith says... I recently went to a Bunnings [Bibra Lake Garden Club meeting. A speaker guy was saying Bentonite would help retain water in our sandy soils . I have found that Mirco;s in Henderson have the product at a reasonable price .It was also suggested I use Zealite and Bentonite together.If this stuff is so good how come our water supply dept are not encouraging all new gardens in the Perth sandy basin to mix this in at building new gardens . I will contact them to find out if they have done any trials. Also the Ag dept.will post when I get some answers ,procco | About the Author Keith3 Perth 2nd September 2011 5:23pm #UserID: 5766 Posts: 1 View All Keith3's Edible Fruit Trees |
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Original Post was last edited: 2nd September 2011 5:25pm | |
snottiegobble says... Hi Keith, for some strange reason I suspect that Coles has the market sewn up for its use as Kitty litter. I just dont understand why bentonite has not been more widely publicised as a soil conditioner & even as an additive in potting mixes. I am adding it to all my mixes & garden beds! | About the Author snottiegobble Bunbury/Busso (smackin the middle) 2nd September 2011 7:45pm #UserID: 3468 Posts: 1458 View All snottiegobble's Edible Fruit Trees |
| About the Author 5th September 2011 11:21am #UserID: 0 Posts: View All 's Edible Fruit Trees |
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