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cherry substitute for Perth

    89 responses

Kath starts with ...
As it's not cold enough to grow "real" cherrys here, are there any Perth readers who have grown something similarly flavoured ? Thanks
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KathK
perth
8th April 2009 10:39am
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Jimmy says...
try acerola cherry/
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8th April 2009 2:47pm
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Kath says...
Hi Jimmy, have you grown acerola cherry in Perth? If so. how did it go? Does it really taste like a cherry??
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KathK
perth
8th April 2009 6:54pm
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Mark says...
Forgive me everyone please,, but I must say "Rubbish." ,,,, I have never been to Perth,but the way I grow plants has nothing to do with what climate or conditions they "Must Have" to grow in. I try to use the old 19th century philosophy that any plant from anywhere in the world CAN be Grown in one's Own area! It is only a matter of trying to recreate those conditions where you live! .... A bit difficult when it comes to trees planted in the ground,but I didn't say it was easy, just possible! Good Luck to those wgo try!
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
8th April 2009 7:12pm
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Firefly says...
Mark, how would you go about providing a "real" cherry tree with enough chill hours in Perth?
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Penrith NSW
8th April 2009 7:18pm
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Julie says...
Kath, whereabouts in Perth are you? If you are near the coast you probably have no hope, but cherries grow well in the hills.
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Roleystone WA
9th April 2009 8:58pm
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Kath says...
Hi Julie,
I'm at Karnup between Rockingham & Mandurah in terrible sand. No frost but have been told by nursery people it's not cold enough for the real cherries. Haven't come across anyone who's tried acerola cherry.I'm afraid I don't agree with Mark re 'grow anything anywhere'-I had 6 years in Darwin-good luck if you want to grow walnuts there or mangos in Tassie!!!
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KathK
perth
9th April 2009 10:10pm
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Minty Burns says...
the minnie royal and royal lee are low chill cherries, www.davewilson.com

www.flemings.com.au are the aussie agents, there is a 3 year waiting list for the trees.

Despite the propaganda the hills do not grow good cherries. Bettenays at irymple have a hrad time and they are colder than most parts of this state including Manjumup.
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10th April 2009 11:39am
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Julie says...
Minty,I had a friend in Chevin Road who grew wonderful cherries! She gave me heaps each year. So maybe it depends on the variety.
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Roleystone WA
10th April 2009 8:06pm
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joe says...
Hi,

I have the acerola cherry in my place it has cropped twice all ready and now in flower again. The flavour is quite good in its own right, not to compare to europeian cherrys witch do require frost.They are crisp and full of juice, worth a try..
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swan valley
13th April 2009 9:07pm
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Mark says...
Firefly,, As I Said, "I have never been to Perth". So,I throw the question back at you, "How would YOU go about it,If You live there?" You know YOUR area better than I. You will able to work out what you can & cannot do. I stand by what I said that it IS Possible! No one said it's Easy! Good Luck,expect failures,but persevere & you WILL be successful!!
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
15th April 2009 4:34pm
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Mark says...
Kath, I'm in Melbourne,NOT Perth! You are free to disagree with me if you choose. But I know that I am right. This is something that was BEING DONE over 400 Years ago! It became a sort of philosophy sometime in the 19th century. That is what I follow when gardening. Still too hard for you to believe,Kath? OK, Try something Simpler like altering the conditions to change/extend the seasons. Nature does this itself.& Mangoes in Tassie? Too EASY!! That is being Done as we type! It is just a matter of Creating the Conditions! Simple! (however,,,It does require that you be able to 'think'.)
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
15th April 2009 4:44pm
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Mark says...
Kath,,, just looking at your initial post on this. You ask about "real" cherries. What do you describe as "real"cherries,& which cherries are Unreal? I don't follow what you mean by that description.
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
15th April 2009 4:48pm
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Kath says...
Mark,you're really on a roll. Thanks for giving Firefly & I permission to disagree with you even though you are always right.I didn't really need a lecture on whether I could 'think' or not-I was simply asking Perth readers for their opinions on growing the normal old cherries you can get in the shops here at Christmas. Thanks Julie, Firefly, Joe & Minty for your constructive advice-it's nice to give/receive gardening tips which is what this forum's about,not being condascending to people like me who are still learning.
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KathK
perth
16th April 2009 4:51pm
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John I. says...
Hi Kath. I new what you meant by real cherries.
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JohnI
Melton
16th April 2009 4:59pm
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Kath says...
Ta John, they are so expensive to buy here it would be great to build a climate controlled cool room to grow my own-however, in the' real world' I'll try a few substitutes. Wish me luck!
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KathK
perth
16th April 2009 6:59pm
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John I. says...
I hate to rub it in Kath but there is a cherry farm about 15 mins from my place that sells to the public at wholesale rates. It wouldn't be Christmas without them. I hope yours turn out.
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JohnI
Melton
16th April 2009 7:15pm
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Kath says...
Hey John. don't worry about rubbing it in-my sister at Bathurst has a friend who has a cherry orchard & she gloats how they get them for months as they have so many different varieties. Meanwhile we pay $20+ kg except end of season when you may get $15/kg but they're ready for the chooks by then!! Enjoy your cheap cherrys & think of us Westerners!
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KathK
perth
16th April 2009 8:46pm
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Grant says...
Hi Kath, Have you tried some of the self pollinating varieties that may require much lower hours of chilling ?. Pretty Gully or Lapins... There are others but I can't think of them at the moment :) Some people go to extreme measures to produce cherries. I have heard of hanging bags of ice from branches, Heaping ice at the base of the tree. One Chinese guy I knew even hinted at placing a small branch in the freezer and grafting it on ??? :D
I guess it's all about selection. If we could grow enough seedlings we would eventually find a tasty cherry that requires no chill at all, Or a Durian that can tolerate Frost. There is the Capulin cherry which is very closely related. If you can find a named variety..... Please tell me where you got it :)
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17th April 2009 7:56am
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Liz says...
Hi - does anyone know how many hours of chill "Pretty Gully" or "Lapins" (or any other "super-low-chill" varieties) require?

I love cherries, too, but according to the WA Ag Dept, the Perth Coastal Plain only gets 287.8-346.7 (average 306.9) hours chill. The hills get 442.0-677.9 (average 521.6). I don't think I've seen any cherry varieties with less than 400 hours chill specified, but I haven't seen numbers for "Pretty Gully"...
Cheers,
Liz

(Link copied below in case anyone else was having as much trouble as I was finding how many hours of chill there ARE in Perth - they also have listings for elsewhere in WA.)

http://www.agric.wa.gov.au/content/HORT/FN/CP/POMEFRUITS/Winter_Chilling_Farmnote.pdf
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Thornlie WA
17th April 2009 10:36am
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Liz says...
Hi again - I just found another thread on here about Pretty Gully cherries

https://www.daleysfruit.com.au/forum/pretty-gully-cherry/

***
[on that thread]Bob says...
Flemings are selling the Minnie Royal and Royal Lee varities (need both for pollination).
400 hours chilling.
Check out www.davewilson.com
***

...sounds like the lower-chill ones should be ok in the hills, but those of us on the flats had probably better just deal with not being able to grow them! :-( ...or hope the acerola cherries taste like "real" cherries :-)
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Thornlie, WA
17th April 2009 2:39pm
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Mark says...
Kath,I'm not always right,but thanks for saying so. If I bit your head off Kath,I do apologize.You got my comments right after I lost an arguement on a group site & I was still P,,,d off. You got the tail end of it & you didn't deserve that. Now, What I saidabout altering conditions is correct,but I ommitted that it is not for everyone's situation. It takes time & constant care etc. (I'm still not too good at it) Yes, I am in Melbourne,& I realize you required replies from Perth people. I replied to you,as I was curious about what you meanr by 'real'cherries. That's all.
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
18th April 2009 11:54pm
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Mark says...
Well John,, how about 'enlightening'the uninformed? I still don't know what Kath meant.
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
18th April 2009 11:59pm
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I'm not allowed says...
Mark, do I understand this right?

You don't understand what tree the original post was referring to (Prunus avium or Prunus cerasus, the common cherry, the little red stone fruit found in supermarkets around Christmas time)

Despite this, you insist it can be grown successfully in a particular area.

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Somewhere, Out There
19th April 2009 8:30am
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Liz says...
Hi - here's Liz's crazy idea from the weekend... I have been pondering Mark's comments in reference to the 19th century idea of growing things way outside their normal range - having read a few books on Victorian kitchen gardens and things, and how they used glasshouses (with woodstoves for additional heating if required) and cloches etc... I'm thinking that it's probably a whole lot easier to figure out ways of growing warm-climate things in cool climates (as for example the Victorians were doing in England) than it is to get cool-climate things to grow in warm climates. (...seems to be much easier to add heat to an area than to remove it.)
Thinking about that, obviously airconditioners and fridges are designed to do precisely that, and with so many people switching to split-system A/C, there are some pretty cheap (and sometimes even free...) second-hand "through-the-wall" airconditioners out there. Also thinking of the fact that a surprising number of people actually get organised enough to do things like putting bird netting over their trees so that they actually get to eat the fruit, I was thinking that if someone in Perth was to plant a smallish, low-chill cherry tree, it would probably not be as horrifically impractical as it looks at first thought to drape it in plastic for month or two over winter, with the plastic tied around the airconditioner, to get the extra hundred-or-so hours of chill it would need to fruit. :-)
...obviously the electrics would need to be protected adequately from the weather, and it would need a nearby outdoor powerpoint - something like a lean-to on the outside of a shed might work - I guess you'd need an electrician to confirm the weather protection required. Also, you'd unfortunately have some greenhouse effect from the plastic, so you'd need the A/C to do more than just the existing chill shortfall - you might be able to minimise that using that green shadecloth/plastic stuff, or shadecloth over the plastic???
Still... it would be quite a lot of fiddling!!! ...anyone in Perth keen enough on cherries to try it? ;-)

...I think I'll stick to easier stuff myself - I have a hard enough time keeping everything watered!
Cheers,
Liz :-)
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Liz
Thornlie (Perth) WA
20th April 2009 2:47pm
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Julie says...
Sounds cheaper and easier to just buy cherries!
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Roleystone WA
20th April 2009 8:02pm
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Kath says...
Thanks for the idea Liz but I think I'll go with the acerola cherry. I don't have air-con in my house so can't see me getting aircon in a planthouse-could buy an awful lot of cherrys for the price of the electricity.
We are netting in our orchard over winter so hopefully I'll get the fruit & not the parrots this year for a change!!Like you.I think I'll stick to the easier stuff!
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KathK
perth
20th April 2009 11:02pm
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paula-f says...
Kath, what about cherry of the rio grand. I can't tell you what they taste like yet, as my 2 trees haven't fruited yet, but from the comments from Daleys, they sound very nice.
Pictures - Click to enlarge

Picture: 1
  
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paulaf1
SE Queensland
21st April 2009 9:38am
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trikus says...
Grumichuma is a superb cherry substitute .
Ever so soft and sweet , something you will never be able to buy at the stupor market . A little slow to start but really worth the wait. I know they grow well here in the tropics , and Mum has one finally bearing in sub-tropics . Certain I have heard of them bearing in north NSW .
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Trikus
Tully
21st April 2009 9:57am
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Kath says...
Thanks, both sound interesting-anyone in Perth got grumichama or cherry of the rio grand to fruit here?
If so I think I'll have a go at both those & the acerola.
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KathK
perth
21st April 2009 11:22am
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Liz says...
Those do sound good! :-)

(...and much more practical than airconditioning a "real" cherry tree!) ;-)

Liz
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Liz
Thornlie (Perth) WA
21st April 2009 4:37pm
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Mark says...
To, 'I'm not allowed..' .. Yes,that's pretty much what I Did mean. (It's not as contradictary as it looks.Yes,I Do know it looks that way!) .... To ALL,, I suggest that you carefuly Read Liz's thoughts on my comments. Liz apparently has a fair idea of what I tried to say!
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
23rd April 2009 6:41pm
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Mark says...
To Liz, "THANK YOU!". At least there is one person over there intelligent enough to think about & understand what I was trying to say. "Well Done Liz!" The way you put it,does sound like an easier read for people & you also applied it to your local area.I did not. What you have read about IS like what I was referring to. (I had in mind)those first delicate ferns from the tropics that were taken back to England & grown in the First terrariums(though they were called something else back then). I also recall that early Aquarists did much the same thing with Tropical fish,Before Heaters were invented! Obviously they succeeded! .... As Liz pointed out so well, it is easier to add heat than to take it away. But the point was folks,,"It IS Possible." (No one is saying that it's not a real pain in the A*****, though,because it IS!) One slight Variation from what Liz said though,if I may. .... I would say that it's easier to alter the growing conditions when working with what You've got in Your own environment,particularly if those conditions you have are stable. (but that's just a guess.) .... Thanks for Thinking About it Liz!!
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
23rd April 2009 7:03pm
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Mark says...
Minty,, Could you please tell me "EXACTLY WHERE,In Irymple they are having so much trouble? What Street are they on,& what names? .... I Might know them!
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
23rd April 2009 7:08pm
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Firefly says...
Don't know for sure, but I suspect the "Bettenays" referred to by Minty Burns are:

Bettenay A L & V A Orchardists
Irymple Road ROLEYSTONE WA 6111
08 93975926

At least they're the most relevant results I can find on google.

(It took longer to type this reply than to conduct the search!)
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Penrith NSW
23rd April 2009 9:10pm
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Firefly says...
Don't know for sure, but I suspect the "Bettenays at irymple" referred to by Minty Burns are:

Bettenay A L & V A Orchardists
Irymple Road ROLEYSTONE WA 6111
08 93975926

At least they're the most relevant results I can find on google.

(It took longer to type this reply than to conduct the search!)
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Penrith NSW
23rd April 2009 11:05pm
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Minty says...
Thats the ones. They are at the end of the nifty Araluen Valley, almost vertical sides keep the chill in.

They sell at Armadale farmers amrkets in season, they will tell you about the many years where they get bugger all crop due to lack of chill.
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24th April 2009 11:43am
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Julie says...
Minty, I will ask my friend, who has since moved from Roleystone, what varieties she was growing.

From memory, the biggest problems she had was from birds. She found leaving a transistor radio in the trees all day helped a lot.
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Roleystone WA
24th April 2009 8:20pm
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Julie says...
Minty - my friend grew Stella (self-pollinating) Bing and Van. They all fruited well.

Kath - I came across this site which has good pictures and info.

users.bigpond.net.au/TropicalFruit.

Makes you long for the tropics, but I hate hot,humid weather!
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Roleystone WA
29th April 2009 8:01pm
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Minty says...
Apple growers have stopped planting apples in Roley as no longer via due to lack of cold.
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1st May 2009 10:51am
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Mark says...
Thanks Firefly! I thought that Minty referred to Irymple just south of Mildura,Vic.!! The people you said, I have never heard of,which is OK because I guess they've never heard of me! Thanks Again. I didn't mean you to Research it, just if it was known,that's all.
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
2nd May 2009 3:34pm
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Mark says...
Minty,, Where I am, it is very cold & apples do well. Some varieties also do well in sub-tropical climates! (I saw some growing when I was on holidays in Bali.) But, I would suppose the problems faced by orchardists/commercial growers are not the same as the person with an apple tree in their backyard. It would (I presume) be easier for the backyard grower to overcome some problems, like 'conditions'for example. But,, Not being a Commercial grower,I am Only guessing.
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Mark12
Frankston,Vic.
2nd May 2009 3:41pm
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Liz says...
Hi Kath (and anyone else who's interested),

Wandilla Garden Centre (on Welshpool Road, east of Roe & Tonkin Hwys) has:
* Acerola Cherry
* Grumichama
* Pitanga / Brazilian/Surinam cherry (same genus as Grumichama & Cherry of the Rio Grande) - although from Glowinski's description, I wouldn't bother with Pitanga - he REALLY didn't like it!

...anyone tracked down Cherry of the Rio Grande in Perth?

Cheers... :-)
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Liz
Thornlie (Perth) WA
2nd May 2009 8:05pm
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Liz says...
Further to the above, Neville Passmore also describes the Pitanga (aka Brazilian cherry or Surinam cherry = Eugenia uniflora) as "somewhere between bloody horrible and OK" ...hmmm - I don't think I'll buy that one! (I don't think Daley's stock it, either, but I've seen it in at least one nursery in Perth.)
http://www.wanatca.org.au/acotanc/Papers/Passmore-1/Author-n-Text.htm
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Liz
Thornlie (Perth) WA
2nd May 2009 8:58pm
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Kath says...
Thanks Liz,
I am going to give the acerola & grumichama a go-no luck with the Rio Grand either-will let you know if I come acroos one.
cheers
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KathK
perth
3rd May 2009 3:30pm
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amanda says...
Hi Kath, I have an Acerola - it tastes nothing like a cherry but i like it anyway. As for your sand...I highly recommend you get your hands on some clay, mush it up and get it into your soil (+ manure)- I have never looked back and don't need wetting agents anymore. It supplies potassium long term (low in sandy soil) and helps slow the water down for trees to take up (lasts indefinitely unlike water crystals). It also is essential for making humus - which i am starting to see now - 3yrs later. The best gardening book I have ever read is "Gardening down under" by Kevin Handreck from the CSIRO. I garden in an extreme climate with alkaline, salty, water repellent and sandy soils, strong ocean winds and 4oC - 42+oC and 200 - 450 mm annual rainfall (ie: I must be mad...) but I grow peaches, plums, apples etc and then jaboticabas, custard apples, all citrus, nuts etc and haver never done so in my life. As Kev says - gypsum can help remove salt from your soil. I use it a lot and have had no ill-effects at all so it won't hurt to try. Hooray for Kevin!! i am now trying a capulin cherry (plant is very vigorous - but don't know what it tastes like yet...)
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amanda19
geraldton WA
10th May 2009 6:11pm
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Haider says...
I had my Stella cherry tree for about 5 years planted in ground in an open area in the back yard with verity of deferent fruit trees. it is been flowring every year but falls all.3 years ago I had the only one fruit left in the tree till it bacame very black and nice big sweet.We celebrate it then,but since then no fruit stays in the tree at all.I feed it with animal organics and lots of blood and bones and when it is fruiting I feed it with NPK.With all of that I had no luck at all.Please help
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Haider
Perth Alexander Hts.
31st May 2009 2:13am
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randey says...
hi guys, i have a grumichama about 2-3 years old -potted and have had a few flowers but no actual setting yet. and because it cost an arm and a leg i will continue to pamper it until it does ###### fruit. same goes for my jaboticaba.
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randey
perth
11th June 2009 6:56pm
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amanda says...
Randey - I have five of these coming shortly - do u have any tips on growing them at all? Yes - they cost a bloody bomb don't they!!....I have cedar bay cherries and jaboticabas which are doing ok - but I just have a gut feeling that maybe they would like a little bit more shade while they are young?
Our sunlight hrs same as Perth but not as cold over winter. What are your thoughts?
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amanda19
geraldton.WA
11th June 2009 9:13pm
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randey says...
similar to the dragonfruit i would suggest amanda. if you are really worried that the sun is going to adversely affect them, try a bit of shade cloth. remember they have to acclimatise the same as we do and don`t forget to keep the blood and bone and poo up to them as well. good luck
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randey
perth
15th June 2009 11:24pm
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randey says...
haider, i would suggest sulphate of potash at time of flowering but remember not to go overboard with the npk, although it encourages leaf and bud growth too much and it will send it into shock and the flowers are the first to go. they are the most sensitive parts of the shrub. good luck
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randey
perth
15th June 2009 11:29pm
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randey says...
to anyone who is having trouble with "chill factor". get youself a bottle of co2 and squirt the freezing gas at the branches for a few minutes (best done in winter as the plant is already in its dormant stage) and making sure you dont freeze the poor thing solid. hey you did say that you can grow anything anywhere. as for growing mango in tassie, build the ground up with piles of rotting mulch and enclose in a tent (made of plastic with breather holes) bingo you have yourself a miniature tropical environment with the mulch giving off much needed heat. ta da
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randey
perth
17th June 2009 7:45pm
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randey says...
i wasn`t really being facetious, these are ideas that have worked for different people all over the world. dont believe me then google the concepts. good luck
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randey
perth
17th June 2009 7:48pm
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virginny says...
If Royal Lee needs only 400 hrs. chill then why not grow the "real " thing . Prunus avium for any pedants lurking around.
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sydney
22nd June 2009 10:17am
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Not the other Mark says...
Does any one know where one can aquire a pure "feral" Prunus avium? And some good old fashioned Damson Plums for that matter.

As for the grow anything anywhere theory - probably possible - Google the Eden Project in Cornwall (photo). But you have to wonder whether the environmental costs sometimes outweigh the benefit of attempting to fit a square plug in a round hole. Surprising sometimes though how some plants will thrive in sites and regions that you would never suspect - Google Guyra tomatoes.
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Not the other Mark
Dorrigo
25th June 2009 10:26am
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Julie says...
Not just the environmental costs Mark. I watched the video of the Eden project, and it cost millions!

Could you get a 'feral' prunus from growing a cherry pip? Just a thought.
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Roleystone WA
25th June 2009 3:10pm
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haider says...
Thanks Randey ,will try every this year even hunging bags of ice ,and it's got to fruit or !!!
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Haider
perth
5th July 2009 6:48pm
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Sue says...
I live 200m from the beach in Esperance, so you could say my backyard is a sand dune. I planted a one meter tall Stella Cherry six months ago. It gets NO morning sun, only midday and afternoon sun. It gets wind all the time. I put large blocks of ice around the base of it while it was in flower. Give it plenty of bore water. Fertilise it about once a month with seasol and powerfeed. It didn't have a lot of fruit for its first year but what it did have was plump and sweet. Not even the 46 degrees temperature hurt the tree in January this year. I only hope it keeps growing the way it has so far. Goodluck
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Sue17
Esperance WA
10th January 2010 4:36pm
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snottiegobble says...
Sounds good Sue, maybe I could get a stella to fruit near Bunbury also? How tall does the tree grow & does it need a pollinator? Where can you buy Stellas & are they real prunus?
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snottiegobble
bunbury
28th April 2010 10:51pm
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john says...
Hi,

Stella grow to about 4 mtrs and are self pollinated along with lappins. You might be ok in Bunbury. Tass1trees has them, he did when i was there last..

john
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bayswater
29th April 2010 12:58am
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Trudy says...
Hi,
I planted a Stella Cherry a few months ago but am now doubtful if it will fruit - so I have ordered a Rio Grande from Diggers, Vic.
I have problems with Fruit fly - both neighbours have fruit trees and do not spray - one leaves the problem to her chooks. Do cherrys have fruitfly?
I suggest putting your cranberry in a pot -it cannot do any harm.
I have a Macadamian tree which is loaded with nuts every year and would recommend this tree to anyone -no fruitfly or climate problems.
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Trudy1
Bayswater
20th May 2010 11:31am
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Rev says...
yes cherries get the fly, and birds love hem

i can put my hand up for grumichama
ive only eaten once in geraldton
very good

trees were?$12.50 at daleys

brazil cherry is $#@!. please do not plant anymore of them. they are just fruit fly magnets

try the capulin

jeff nugent in nannup has them
http://www.permacultureplants.net/
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Rev
north qld
22nd June 2010 2:07am
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Nicole says...
I have self cherry tree Starkisma
it has flowered for about 6 years with no cherries. I have been told that unless you have the required chiling at soil level you will not get proper flower formation so will not get fruit.
I have a stella about 3 years old now. still no fruit. Some one suggested bury ice cream containers of ice in the root zone. I haven't tried it yet. I have a Morello (sour)cherry (prunus avium) that friuts very well. It has a lower chilling requirement and is self fertile. But I would still check the numbers of hours chilling required. If you don't mide your cherries a little on the tart side they taste like cherries.
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Narellan(Camden )NSW
30th July 2010 5:12pm
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allybanana says...
allybanana says...
Why not get togeather a bulk buy for the west coast of royal lee and minni royal low chill cherries 200-300 chill hours see http://www.davewilson.com/br10/catalog/cherry.html flemmings is the australian producer.
http://www.flemings.com.au/default.asp. You need to buy a minnimum of 50 total and they said they only sell these varieties to orchadists. I am contemplating this for next year on the south coast as my family are apple orchadists.

Someone could put out the word for who is interested, Do a bulk buy through a orchard they know and then distrubute the barerooted trees out by post to every one interested. A bit of work for the orderer packer and poster but perhaps they and the orchard could get a couple of trees for free. If you are interssted get your orchadist onto it ASAP as they are doing the grafting for next years trees now.


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30th July 2010 10:58pm
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Charles cant spell says...
There is a Brazilian Cherry at the City Farm grounds in Perth. When I was there for a Permaculuture Show, Tom gave me a couple to taste, and thought it was very tasty, I guess its a bit of personal taste, specific plant and I am sure climate/location. I have a small tree going now.
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Charlesstillcantspell1
Perth Innaloo
31st July 2010 1:11am
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Tom says...
Hi Kath,
hope you don't mind a little input from far away. We're in Orlando, Florida - nearly the exact opposite side of the globe from you and with a very similar climate to Perth - just offset six months. Our soils are sandy too - in some areas of our yard, it actually repels water. We've had great success with three Eugenia species, all of which are similar tasting to chill cherries.

Eugenia aggregata - Cherry of the Rio Grande (named after the state in Brazil, not the river between Mexico & Texas). When the fruit are very dark red to almost black, they're at their sweetest with a very close taste to "market" cherries. We have one in full sun and the other in dappled shade, and they fruit about the same.

Eugenia braziliensis - Grumichama. This is probably the one with the closest taste to a Bing Cherry, but there are little green leaves left on each fruit (left-over flower wings) which put some folks off. We just cut them off or deal with them (they're tasteless - it's a texture thing to some). One's in full sun, the other's in dappled shade, and the one in the sun fruits substantially more than the other.

Eugenia uniflora var. Zill Dark - Black Surinam Cherry. This is a really sweet fruit - like a spicey cherry and smooth texture. Nothing like Red Surinam Cheries. Seems to have a lot of pectin and makes good pies. Once again, the one in the sun makes more fruit than the one in the shade, but not by much.

We bought two of each to improve pollination, and that seems to have worked for us. We use only fish emulsion to fertilize and grass clippings to mulch and acidify the soil; and, after about three years, the sand has turned into water-retaining, black compost right under the plants (with occasional sifting with a hand fork).

Wish you well!
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Tom
Orlando, Florida
31st July 2010 2:18am
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Original Post was last edited: 31st July 2010 10:56am
amanda says...
Tom - what great information! Many of us are growing these plants (and in sand in western australia) Do u know if your Black Surinam Cherry is seed grown? Do u think it would come true to type?
I have only seen the red ones (and have a red myself) mine hasn't fruited yet - but by all accounts they are not nice.

Would love to hear what else u are growing?
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amanda19
Geraldton. WA
31st July 2010 11:16am
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Phil@Tyalgum says...
Forbidden Fruits Nursery near me has the black Surinam Cherry listed as available. I took a drive down there today as I was having lunch at the Brunswick Heads Pub (owned by Strop and Delvene Delaney) but worse luck, they're closed on weekends. I think because he takes his trees to the local markets on Sat/Sun. Will definitely pick up a black fruited tree and hopefully have seeds to share down the track if anyone wants them.
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phil@tyalgum
Murwillumbah
31st July 2010 6:24pm
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amanda says...
Phil - that would be really nice! as the plant is probably not allowed thru quarantine to WA ..that new myrtle rust thing (rio grande not)
Although I haven't checked this for certain.
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amanda19
Geraldton. WA
31st July 2010 6:45pm
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Tom says...
Hi Amanda,
it's always nice to hear from you and see that smiley picture of you! Our Black Surinams are grafted, but I don't know onto what stock. I was told that they don't grow true from seed, but I've never tried to see if it's true. I heard that you might get a red from a black seed. Our neighbor has a red hedge, so I've tasted hers; they're no comparison to the black ones - could've been a completely different fruit with a bit oily and gritty texture (like a sticky, spongy pear) and a lingering sharp aftertaste. (They make a nice xeriscape hedge, though!)

I think you and I grow very similar things, and it took revamping the soils in some parts over a long time just like you did (just in a different way). We're successful with the eugenias; cattley guava; 'wonderful', 'white', and 'hoku botan' pomegranates; your country's davidsonia are taking well (thanks for the advice on them, by the way - and you too, Rev.); persian, indian sweet, finger, calamondin, and key limes; chinotto; variegated pink eureka, meyer, and sandokan lemons; limequats; several banana species; fuyu, giant fuyu, and tanenashi persimmons; hass avocado (by some miracle I reckon); anna and ein schemer apples; jaboticaba; yellow jaboticaba; hak ip lychee; tropical apricot (a dovyalis hybrid natural to Florida); ceylon gooseberry; african mallow (for salads and tea as well as looks - you'd love this one!); several species of passion fruit; all sorts of bamboos (some for shoots - some for looks); natal plum; and a few herbs (rosemary, chives, scrub mint).

We've failed at most stone fruits like nectarines and peaches, dorsett apple, lavender (got one dying right now again in the heat and humidity), basil, parsely, cherimoya, real blood oranges, and beets.

I wish we could do the Kaffir Plums and Sappotes like you, but I've heard they never do well here and haven't tried.

There's one more I'm after - Barbados Cherry (Acerola); but we've run out of room on our downtown lot if we're going to keep any sort of order and aesthetic to it all, and I don't see a way (yet) to fit it in. Yours looks great!
Cheers!
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Tom
Orlando, Florida
31st July 2010 9:25pm
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Original Post was last edited: 1st August 2010 3:15am
amanda says...
Hi Tom - nice selection of plants there! I think I know what you mean about the red pitanga/surinam - maybe "astringent"/resinous? I have cedar bay cherry which tastes like this - not very nice.
It must be very humid where u are - although lavender (and geraniums) usually die on me too (1km from beach).

It would be worth giving the white sapote (Casimoroa) a try tho'? You may be surprised. Apparently the Lemon gold is more tropical in it's requirements. They say if u can grow citrus you can grow these guys....

Your California Rare Fruit Growers association would know. They have great info.
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amanda19
Geraldton. WA
1st August 2010 8:19pm
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Jaahda says...
this is an interesting forum. Can sumone let me know where i can get an acerola tree from here in perth please?
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Jaahda
Gosnells
28th June 2011 12:42pm
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Jimmy says...
Tass1 trees, Great Northern Hwy, Baskerville
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28th June 2011 1:48pm
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Mike says...
I was disappointed with the taste my acerolas and brazil cherries in spite of enjoying them when I was a kid and they got the chop.My yellow and black gramichamas also won't set the world on fire and they are a long way removed from real cherries.Published accounts were too generous in their praise.I have never tried cherry of rio grande but read plenty published on them and wonder if they are substantially better than the above 'cherries'.
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Cairns
28th June 2011 11:23pm
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Peter says...
A reminder that BJ found out that the low chill cherries Royal Lee and Minnie Royal (see previous post) will be available in Perth for 2012 - so no need to look for a substitude.
However, Eugenias and Syzigiums are something different and it's an interesting taste by itself apart from cherries...
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Peter36
 
29th June 2011 2:37pm
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Bob says...
I would like to see the proof of that.
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29th June 2011 5:32pm
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Mike says...
I love the myrtaceae and think some of the 13cm extra sweet asian S.samarangense that we don't have here are by far the best of Eugenia and Syzigiums.Cherries like bing however are quite an exquisite fruit when you get good ones.
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Cairns
29th June 2011 6:04pm
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Mikey Mike says...
I have a Starcrimson cherry tree in Perth I'm 2km from Hillaries Marina (Ocean)and I have had cherries for 4 out of 5 past years. The year I did not get cherries is because they dropped of in really hot weather when I did not water the tree enough. But it is a very slow growing tree!
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3rd July 2011 1:28am
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Haider says...
Rndey would it work if I use CO2.becouse I used everything, even ice on roots and hanging on branches all though winter last year but with all of that I could get one fruit left in the tree ,when the whole tree became white during flouring and lots of fruit then all gone but only one left to bacome very nice one like the one I had 6 years ago.by the way I work in commercial refrigeration,so I might install a freezer room on it in witer haha.
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Haider
 
9th July 2011 2:25am
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Gus says...
Where did you get your starcrimson cherry tree from mikey mike? sounds great.
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gus
 
9th July 2011 10:28am
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Mikey Mike says...
Waldecks near cnr of Wanneroo rd and Hepburn Ave the label on it was from Flemings
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13th July 2011 8:12pm
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Chrissy says...
I posted regarding Stella Cherries in Perth hope you dont mind that I cross post.
Anyone successfully grow Stella cherries in Perth?
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14th July 2011 4:29pm
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blossom says...
how come I just got 7 kg from my bing and van in kalamunda then?
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blossom
KALAMUNDA,6076,WA
17th December 2015 1:50am
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Liz says...
blossom - you get significantly more winter chill hours in the hills than on the Perth Coastal plain (aka "the flats" for hills people). (Do you get reliable annual crops like that? I've heard that some people in Roleystone get good cherry crops in some years, and virtually nothing in others, depending on how cold the winter is.)

Chrissy - I don't know of anyone successfully growing Stella on the Perth coastal plain. Your best bet would be to get hold of one of the new(ish) double-grafted Minnie Royal / Royal Lee ultra-low-chill cherries. I pre-ordered one at Dawson's last autumn to get one when they came in (which happened in late June), and I've been told Tass1 also take pre-orders. Mine is still a baby, so I can't personally vouch for its success, but the chill hours stated for it should be covered by what we get in Perth.
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Liz
Perth (Thornlie)
17th December 2015 12:41pm
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pound1 says...
hello,liz,i know were to buy rio grande cherry in perth ,I want to,can you help me.i have no way of getting to perth.
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pound1
BEACHLANDS,6530,WA
23rd December 2015 3:17pm
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pound1 says...
kath hi,do u have rio grande cherry.
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pound1
BEACHLANDS,6530,WA
23rd December 2015 8:35pm
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denise1 says...
I bought a grafted rio grande cherry which flowers well only no fruit. Perhaps they need cross pollenating to set. You may need two seedlings or two separate named plants
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denise1
auckland NZ
25th December 2015 1:21pm
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blossom says...
the laplan is reliable 10 years old tree get at least 2 kg from tree since its been about 4/5 years old. 7yo royal rainier is ok some years better than others. van is more reliable than bing but tend to get some years with small crop others with big crop bing has had 2 years of no crops. ron's seadling is a small croper on/off cropping I have mini royal/royal lee they are small we got in march heaps of flowers no fruit but understandable since only been in the ground since march my stella and sunburst died and I have not replaced them (burst pipe while on holidays no water for 2 weeks in jan.) I had them 4 years no fruit but they small trees still. my bing and van do better from ice placed once a week round thr bottom I freaze 3 icecream containers per tree for the 3 months of winter. getting better results I think my bing van and ron's seadling are 7 years old the laplan is 10 and the reat are new. they do better with good watering 2 we have done better cherrys now we have had the water tank 3 years. we always get some cherrys for christmas but this year was bumper.
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blossom
KALAMUNDA,6076,WA
28th December 2015 2:13am
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Backyard gardener says...
Hi Kath
Just reading comments on cherry trees in Perth. Have you found a supplier yet. I have been reading about low chill varieties Mini Royal and Royal Lee but not sure where to buy them. daleys don't send them over this way.. I have had great success with low chill apples here, so wanted to give the cherry tree a go.
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Backyard gardener
Port Kennedy
20th February 2019 5:28pm
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blossom says...
The only reliable cherry I have is low chill mini royal royal lee, some of the others give reduced crops aka 1/2 kg or so or none some years. have had 3 good reliable crops coming in just before Christmas on my 4 .5 year old tree oh did I mention it’s in a wine barrel and growing amazing. last year last year every cherry cropped some in the ground some are in pots, it was cold but this year not so good except mini royal royal lee. it’s true hills gets more cold I would not think flats cold grow Cherry’s but if they tryed I would try mini royal low chill I brought my original from Dawson’s in forest field but I brought my second one from Guildford garden center I also brought the trixi dwarf cherry and have had 1 years of crops from it but not sure it will crop all the time yet.
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blossom
CARMEL,6076,WA
21st February 2019 10:41am
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